Which side makes a better case?
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  • 2 years ago
    • 2 years ago
      • 2 years ago

        @edie_weinhardt Thanks for your analysis.

        Help me understand the funding decision. It was a shame funding didn't really enter the discussion until late, and that it seems to have overshadowed everything else - that said, I wasn't sure how it was a W for him.

        There's no brink analysis to solvency: he's saying we don't have a lot of money, and that meditation will cost money. Without any tipping analysis (where spending money becomes too much) how was just arguing that implementation has a cost enough to outweigh all else?

        Second, could you walk me through why my "spend differently" arg wasn't convincing? I was trying to argue that respending (maybe not on peruvian basketweaving this time) would be the better solution, not creating mutual exclusivity in education. You say I don't ask where breakfast programs have a unique cost (in that why would there be a choice), but I thought that's what I conveyed in my final statements "

        Third, I'm a little confused as to how the solvency arg checks out. If we don't have money, then we probably can't afford any of the programs he's suggesting as a counter solution (unless he runs some really tight cost comparison analysis, I didn't hear it). If we do have money, the only way there's mutually exclusivity in the options is if we ONLY have enough money for breakfast OR meditation, meaning we have to choose. I'm just not hearing that, so I wasn't sure why the argument sold the round for you. I'm primarily hearing "it costs money" (ofc it does) and "we don't have unlimited money" (ofc we don't).

        I completely respect your decision, you're completely correct to vote for who persuaded you more. I'm just more trying to understand where I fell short. Thanks for your help in advance!

      • 2 years ago

        @lewisoflime I interpreted con's arguments as saying we need to look at what the education budget is, so it's unlikely money would be pulled from another department. I also bought that non-profits wouldn't be able to fund nationwide implementation, so schools would need to pay for it, which would lead to the trade off impacts. I think there's a high enough risk of this given how little money some public schools have to work with. But I understand your questions, and I hope this helped!

      • 2 years ago

        @lewisoflime I know this wasnt adressed at me but I feel this may help.

        I dont feel I brought up funding late, my introductory speech clearly flagged I was running an opportunity cost case and I used the "teach every great work " as an analogy to where we already jettison beneficial policy b/c of finacial mutual exclusivity.

        I also think I made a case for tipping points by exploiting youre stance of hiring professionals in every school. I was afraid you'd bring up how you can use meditation apps or guided online sessions using smart boards etc. Absent that characterisation, I think its fair that a case of hiring tonnes of proffesionsals would invite a opportunity cost response

        I could of course be wrong, bt thats at least how I was thinking during tje debate

      • 2 years ago

        @benmouse42 Totally makes sense, a fair and good argument mate!

    • 2 years ago
      • 2 years ago

        separate from my adjudication, and more to debate the topic personally (my personal position is Pro on this topic, I am also a big fan of meditation personally)..

        i actually think guided meditation sessions (one 15 minute session) using YouTube videos or the sort can provide the same level of expertise you seek in an in-class meditation expert.. as such, the same teachers giving a math or history class can just ask everyone to stay seated for 15 minutes after one of the classes to listen to a youtube video play in the background, while everyone listens and breathes with the instructor...

        no?

      • 2 years ago

        @yaz Thanks for your analysis, yaz. @benmouse42, huge congrats! best of luck going forward

    • 2 years ago
      • 2 years ago

        @benmouse42 Congrats for making it to the finals!!!

        @lewisoflime Probably one of the best debates.. I had all the judges messaging me privately about how much they enjoyed it and how hard the decision was :-) Thank you so much for participating and stay tuned for your debate for the battle for the 3rd place with Orion!

        • 2 years ago

          Ladies and gentlemen, this is debate at it's finest.

          • 2 years ago

            "'Just notice your breath,” says the instructor, Satyani McPherson, “where it manifests in the body and the abdomen. ... And whatever is appearing, just allow it to be there.”

            A student walks in late, and the door slams. No one moves. Eyes are closed. Fourteen chests rise and fall.

            Eastern is one of hundreds of K-12 schools — many of them in urban areas, attended mainly by minority students who qualify for free school lunch — in the US participating in an unconventional, informal experiment in training students to become more focused and less reactive."

            https://www.vox.com/science-and-health/2017/5/22/13768406/mindfulness-meditation-good-for-kids-evidence

            • 2 years ago

              this wasn't explicitly referencing the Quiet Time Program - a similar meditation program taught in washington D.C. My b for the incorrect program link - this was a diff one. same concept tho

          • 2 years ago

            If anyone is interested in reading the Meta-Analysis

            https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10648-014-9258-2

            • 2 years ago